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Drysdale - a Douglas sept
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Drysdale is considered a sept of the Douglas clan, but it is quite likely that this was a separate family which existed previous to when the three Douglas brothers adopted the Drysdale name. A sept is a family that can be related to a clan or larger family for various reasons. Usually this came about either through marriage or by a small family seeking protection from a larger and more powerful neighbour.
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Story of the creation of the Drysdale family
The following is said to tell the story of the creation of the Drysdale family, it was actually part of the Black Douglas clan which remained in Scotland, following their failed attempt against the Scots crown in 1455. [Earlier references to Drysdale, or Dryfesdale can be found]
"On the Twentieth Day of May, One Thousand Five Hundred and Three Years
We, Thomas, William, and James Douglass, sons of the departed Thomas Douglass, of Brushwood Haugh, in the parish of Drysdale, and Shire of Dumfries, left our native place for the reason here assigned, viz:- Defending our just and lawful rights against our unjust neighbour, Johnston of Greenstonhill, who, being determined to bring water to his mill through our property, and having obtained leave of his friend, the King, began his operations on Monday, the 16th of May, We prevented him by force.
The next day he brought twenty of his vassels to carry on the work. We with two friends and three servants, (eight in all,) attacked Johnston with his twenty, and, in the contest, fourteen of his men were killed, along with their base leader. A report of these proceedings was carried to the King, and we were obliged to fly, (the tocsin being sounded).
We took shelter under the shadow of the Ochil Hills, in a lonely valley on the river Devon. After having lived there a full two years, we returned home in disguise, but found all our property in the possession of Johnston's friends, and a great reward offered for our lives. We, having purchased a small spot, called the Haugh of Dollar, and changed our names to the name of our Parish, are clearly in mind to spend the residue of our days under the ope of the Ochils, and wish the name of Drysdale to flourish in the lonely valley. The King passed through this with his Court on the 12th of June, 1506, going from Stirling to Falkland - dined on Halliday's green. (an eastern neighbour;) but we were not recognised."
The above story has been preserved among the desendants of Thomas, William, and James Douglass, now known by the name of Drysdale, and copied at several times by different individuals - first, by Simon Drysdale of the Haugh of Dollar, in the year 1620; by Robert Drysdale of Tillicoultry, in 1708; by John Drysdale, Dunfermline, in 1835; by James Drysdale, Dumfermline, in 1838; by John Montrose Drysdale, in 1841; by George Drysdale, Aberdeen, in 1845; by David Drysdale, Glasgow, in 1857; by John Harrower Drysdale, Aylmer, Ontario, Canada, in 1920; and now by Nicholas Edwin Kontzie (great-great-grandson of Jane Drysdale), Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada, in 2000.
Discussion Forum
The Drysdales of Dollar
Started by Ronald Drysdale. Last reply by Ronald Drysdale yesterday. 18 Replies 1 Like
The 1998 publication - 'History of Dollar' contains a lot of information concerning early Drysdale feuars & tenants in Dollar i.e. residents of Dollar prior to 1605 & thereafter:…Continue
Tags: Lag, Dumfries, Dollar, Douglas, Gregorsoune
The origins of the surname Drysdale
Started by Ronald Drysdale. Last reply by Russell Lynn Drysdale Mar 1. 26 Replies 2 Likes
In a previous post I gave some background information on the Barony and lands of Dryfesdale:…Continue
Tags: Moffat, Johnston, Maxwell, Gresson, Kirkpatrick
Early Douglas and Drysdale migrants to South Africa
Started by Ronald Drysdale. Last reply by Ronald Drysdale Oct 26, 2024. 3 Replies 1 Like
Hi all,Following on from William Douglas's recent comment:…Continue
Spelling of Douglas and Drysdale family names - variants
Started by Ronald Drysdale Oct 1, 2024. 0 Replies 2 Likes
Hi all, As many of you will have discovered when researching historical ancestors electronically, oftentimes important records are missed because the surname is spelt in a slightly different way,…Continue
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Comment by William Douglas on Tuesday
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Arms of Thomas Drysdale: Argent a saltire and chief azure, four crosses moline gules in the cantons.
Thomas Drysdale was Lyon Depute of The Court of the Lord Lyon, or Lyon Court in 1627
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lord_Lyon_King_of_Arms
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Comment by Ronald Drysdale on March 1, 2025 at 0:15
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Hi William
Up until about the year 1600 the two respective family lines are defined/limited by available source material and the fact that there were very few Drysdales around at that time.
Thereafter the growth in the numbers of descendants is exponential and quickly arrives at many thousands of relatives - including many 100s of Drysdales - some lines are obviously unsourced & suspect but the majority are generally OK
- Note also that there are many people who have not been entered in the FS world tree.My genealogy program crashes by the time it gets to about the 12th generation of descendants from the Douglas brothers and the same thing happens at the 14th generation of descendants of the Tillicoultry Drysdales.
I haven't worked out yet if there is any program that can limit family lines to male descendants (Drysdales) only.
On the last Familysearch download I did - for Drysdales from Tillicoultry circa 1410 - after about 15 hours of download and about 30,000 names, (up until 1895 & 14 Generations) the program gave up.
Similarly on the last Familysearch download I did - for Douglas/Drysdales of Dollar circa 1448 - after about 10 hours of download and about 13,500 names (up until 1895 & 12 Generations) the program gave up.
Note although starting at a later date the Douglas/Drysdale names list seemed to be expanding quicker.
Of course the easy alternative is to trace each individuals family line on the FamilySearch tree back to the root
Root person in Tillicoultry - Drysdale ID number G2S7-JYJ
Root person for Dollar - Thomas Douglas ID number YMP4C-15YThere are other ways but the limiting factors are the download times from FS and the vast numbers of persons in the later generations (the software - Ancestral Quest - and my PC seem to have trouble with big numbers)
Still a work in progress
Best regards
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It would be interesting to know the connections of the various Drysdales mentioned in the different versions of this story that you have identified.
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Hi william,
Your link to the Clan Douglas Association of Australia newsletter of 1987 is quite interesting in that it reveals yet another slight variation to the 1503 story. In all I have found three CDAA newsletters with the 1503 story:
CDAA Newsletter 2 - 1987 - entitled Know your roots "The origin of Drysdale"
CDAA Newsletter 8 - 1989 - entitled Septs "The Drysdale Family"
CDAA Newsletter 87 - 2010 - entitled "THE ORIGIN OF DRYSDALE - A SEPT OF CLAN DOUGLAS" - this is an identical copy of that printed in Newsletter 2The text in Newsletters 2 & 8 differs slightly and gives an indication as to why there are so many slightly different variants of this story:
Newsletter 2 says the story was copied by four people (presumably by hand) and then first printed in 1858 and again in the same form in 1863, 1941 and 1970
Newsletter 8 again says it was copied by four people (presumably by hand) and then printed in 1841, 1870, 1881, 1892 & 1938 (giving possible variations) and copied in 1987
Relevant text;
CDAA Newsletter 2 - 1987
Copied.......First by Simon Drysdale of the Haugh of Dollar in the vear 1620; by Robert Drysdale of Tillecoultry AD 1708, by John Drysdale, Dumfermline, 1835; by James Hogg Drysdale, Dunfermline 1858 and printed first in the year 1858 by John Drysdale, Montrose, again in same form by the last named John Drysdale of Glasgow 1863,and by Henry Dron Drysdale of Haddington in 1941, and lastly by Donald Douglas of Morven, Queensland, Australia in 1970......
CDAA Newsletter 8 - 1989
Copied .......first by Symon Drysdale of the Haugh of Dollar, 1620; by Robert Drysdale, Tillicoultry, 1708; by John Drysdale, Dunfermline, 1835; by James Drysdale, Dunfermline, 1838; printed by John Drysdale, Montrose, 1841; printed by William Drysdale, Alva, 1870; printed for Robert Drysdale, Tillicoultry, 1881; printed for David Drysdale, Warwick Lodge, Brixton, London, 1892; printed for Alexander Drysdale, Alloa, 1938; and copied by Neil M. Douglas Ewins in 1987 a descendant of David Drysdale, tailor in Sauchie, Clackmannanshire, and Janet McGregor
(married 5th January, 1800, Clackmannan)........With regard to the Origins of the name Drysdale, you may be interested to note that I've just about finished modifying the Familysearch worldwide family tree to reflect the Dumfriesshire (Ingebald) origins of the Tillicoultry, Staffordshire and Yorkshire Drysdales (plus the odd Drysdale families cropping up in Annandale and England in 1500s) and the Douglas origins of the Drysdales in Dollar. The Ingebald and Douglas family lines lead (in theory) to the totality of the Drysdales that are found today - it's about a 50/50 split.
Based on my family lines in the 'Tree' I am related to Ingebald through the Tillicoultry Drysdales & I am also related to the Douglas Brothers though the Dollar Drysdales (James Drysdale of Lochleven fame was my 13th Great Grandfather!)
Best regards
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The origins and some biographies can be found in this newsletter:
https://www.douglashistory.co.uk/history/CDAA&CDSA/CDAA%20Newsl...
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4149 Private James Drysdale, 1st Battalion the Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders (Princess Louise's). Deployed with his battlion to South Africa for the Second Anglo Boer War, sailing on the Orcana about 27 Oct 1899, and arrived at the Cape about 18 Nov 1899. Along with the 2nd Black Watch, 1st Highland Light Infantry, and 2nd Seaforths, they formed the 3rd or Highland Brigade under Major General Wauchope. On arrival they joined the Kimberley Relief Force under Major General Lord Methuen, who with three brigades were on their way to raise the Boer siege of Kimberley. He would have fought at the battles of Modder River and Magersfontein leading to the relief of Kimberley, and the battle of Paardeberg 18-27 Feb 1900 and the capture of Bloemfontein and advance towards Heilbron (South of Johannesburg). Died of disease in No 38 Stationary Hospital, Rustenburg. He is also commemorated on the Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders (Princess Louise's) Boer War memorial at Stirling Castle, The Castle Esplanade, Stirling, Scotland (see: https://www.warmemorialsonline.org.uk/memorial/116930).
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/211155208/j-drysdale
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Dunfermline Abbey
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Drysdale war casualties
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I dont recall seeing this before...
But probably have!
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/127413994/william-drysdaleI have sugested an edit in that if he was 62 at date of death he could not have been born in 1776
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